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Mukhtar Shagari is a former Deputy Governor of Sokoto State. In this interview, he speaks on the All Progressives Congress (APC) primary elections, issues around the consensus mode of primary, how some aspirants who felt cheated alleged imposition of candidates. He also speaks about the strength of the party, why those who lost at the party’s primaries will not defect because most of their members are committed to the party’s ideals, among others. JOY ANIGBOGU brings the excerpts:
What do you make of the widespread irregularities that trailed the APC primary elections against the integrity and perceived reputation of your party?
Well, the All Progressive Congress, I must give the party and the leadership of the party and the president credit for insisting that where consensus is not possible, we should go for the direct and proper elections. And it has been taking place everywhere. And problems when you’re having an election, especially where people are aspiring to contest for certain seats and so on, it is expected that there will be some few problems here and there, and there will be complaints here and there. It is part of democracy. That is why we are a great party, because we give people the opportunity to voice out their misgivings and so on and so forth. It has been the norm of democracy in this country that whoever loses, always comes up with one excuse or the other and so on. Otherwise, what has been going on, I think, is good. And it’s good for democracy because the party has given the opportunity to the ordinary members to elect people, not through the ways it used to be, I mean, through delegates, which is very costly. I can say that the State House of Assembly primary that took place in Kano State has gone very well, and it’s wonderful. Out of the 40 constituencies we have, it was only in two constituencies that we actually had an election. The rest were based on consensus. Of course, everything has gone on peacefully, and we are really very happy with what happened in Kano. Kano has shown real maturity. The members of the party in Kano have actually shown maturity, and they have shown that they are behind the decisions taken by the party, that you can have consensus, where consensus is not possible, you can go for election. That’s what has happened. So, I think so far, so good. But of course, complaints will continue to come in. That’s why the party has also set an appeal committee in the event that anybody has any problem, he can go to the appeal committee.
The issue of a consensus has been somewhat of a bone of contention in the party. Do you think that APC is losing control of its primaries because of this?
No, the APC is in total control. I’ve said it, I mean this earlier on, that wherever there is contest for an office of whatever nature, some people, if they lose out, they will complain. And that’s normal. And that’s acceptable. And that is why the party has set up the appeal committees in all the states where these primary elections are taking place. So APC is intact. APC is a strong party. APC is a party that has given its members the opportunity to elect people or the opportunity to sit down and agree among themselves. And I think the consensus that has taken place in all the places is just good for the party and we are strong and we are going to go.
You seem to be unmindful of the dissenting voices and the strong resentment that have emerged from these APC primaries. A lot of people are saying that there is an impending implosion ahead for the party. What do you make of this claim?
Well, first of all, I’m not in a position to tell Kano people what mode of election they should go through. There are two ways of doing it. Either you go through consensus or you go through direct election. And like I said, wherever there is a contest like this, the minority and some people will say that, look, we didn’t like it, it was not fair and all this kind of thing. So it’s just part of democracy. Allow people to complain when they feel that they have reasons to complain. I said that’s why the party has set appeal committees.
The Electoral Act section 87 subsection 1 had made provision that all the aspirants need to agree on the consensus arrangement. And if this fails, there is a provision to go for direct primaries. Why is the APC shunning that arrangement provided by the Electoral Acts?
No, I actually don’t think that is the true situation. In democracy, what happens is that wherever the majority goes that is where it will be. So the APC has not violated any of these things and I’ve said that in every contest of this nature, there will be people who will complain. But the truth of the matter is that the consensus arrangement has been working for the party and it is good. And it has saved the party and even the candidates themselves the possibility of them to spend so much money unnecessarily because of the effort they are making to get a platform to contest. Now, wherever people decide that we need consensus let them have consensus. It is constitutional to do so. Wherever the majority of the people feel that we must go for election, we go for election. And that’s what has happened. And I’ve said to you in Kano, out of the 40 constituencies, only two went for direct election because the party believes in democracy where people feel that the two people or three people feel that, look, we must go for direct election. That’s what has happened. So that is not a violation of the Electoral Act at all. But of course, you have your own opinion. But the truth is the truth.
You’ve really played it down what’s been going on in terms of people revolting and in your words, complaining. But analysts are also saying that these complaints could end up as defections. What do you say to this?
I don’t think so. People who are in APC are committed members of the party and they believe in the party. In fact, it is people from the other parties that are leaving and coming into APC. APC is a strong party. It has disciplined members who believe in the ideas of the party. So this is not going to be a reason for people to start going to other political parties. The other political parties are not even on ground. Many of them are not even political parties. They are just a gathering of people who want to grab power and use it for their own personal purposes and so on and so forth. I can assure you that APC has a mechanism of solving problems, no matter how big those problems are, people who are disgruntled are free to go to the appeals committees in their states and complain. And then the appeal committee will listen and the party will also abide by whatever decisions the appeal committees take in this matter. So I do not envisage a situation where people will start leaving, you are in a well-built house, where you are protected from sunshine, from rain and so on, and then you’re not going to go to a place where there’s no roof on your head. I don’t think APC members will do that. They are disciplined people and we believe in this party. We love this party because it is the only party we believe that can take Nigeria to a greater height.
When you look at the reports from different quarters of the APC primaries, where do you draw the line between a consensus arrangement and the alleged imposition of candidates?
You see, you are trying to give an impression that there is a problem within the APC. There is no problem within the APC. Elections have taken place in many places, the Senate, the House of Assembly and so on. And of course, we’ve said that people are free to complain. We know that when there’s an election, people will still complain, no matter the outcome. What we are saying is this, I don’t know where in the states where a position was made. As far as I’m concerned, I’m in Kano, and in Kano, nobody has complained to us that people have been imposed on them. They were told about this idea of consensus and people agreed to it. In my state, in Sokoto State, in fact, people sat down, agreed on what to do, and we agreed in Sokoto State for consensus. In fact, it was only in my constituency that one of the contestants said he did not agree with consensus, and we went for an election. But I want to emphasise that wherever you have an election, whether it’s a general election, whether it’s within the party and so on, people will still complain, and that’s why democracy is beautiful, and that’s why APC is beautiful, because it allows its members to complain, and they look in these complaints. So what I’m saying is one, people agreed on consensus, and I have not seen any appeal coming to the appeal committee that is set up for Kano, where anybody came up to say that, well, we are complaining against the consensus that has taken place. It could be possible that some of the people who are complaining have even nothing to do with the party, and of course with the elections that have taken place.
What is your view on what has happened in the Rivers State APC primaries?
I think what is happening in Rivers is also democracy at work. People are actually complaining about Rivers because the press has been amplifying what is happening there. At the moment the sitting governor there had said that he’s not going to participate in any primary or any election, and that he’s not even going to contest. We don’t know what’s going to happen, but for me, I have no idea and have nothing to say about Rivers State other than to call on the members of the party in the state to come together, and there should be peace in Rivers State so that we can have a free and fair election in that state, and I believe APC will still win.
When you look at the words coming from Governor of Rivers State, Mr. Sim Fubara, he said he’s been made to take a necessary but difficult decision. Does that not suggest some level of coercion in his decision making?
Governor Fubara is a matured person. He is well educated. He’s the governor of the state, and like any other Nigerian, he has the right to participate in an election if he wants, and he also has the right not to participate if he doesn’t want. So he has taken a decision, let us respect his decision that the decision that he has taken, that he is not going to be part of the democratic process for 2027. I don’t want to insinuate anything because I don’t know his reasons. I don’t know what has happened but he said very clearly that he has made consultations and that he will still remain in the APC. He has not said anybody forced him to do what he has done. It is his own personal decision, so who are we to question his personal decisions?
What is your message now to any disappointed APC members?
Any disappointed APC member, if he is an aspirant, he has the right to appeal because there is an appeal committee, but my own message to all members of the APC is that we must concentrate on the issue of winning election in 2027. We must make sure that our party remains strong as it has always been. We must also try to give support to whoever has won, and I will appeal to people, don’t go on appeal for all these things. Remain in your party, sit down and solve the problems you have locally in the interest of the party and in the interest of this country. I am quite confident that at the moment, there is no candidate that will be able to defeat President Bola Ahmed Tinubu. And I want to appeal again to the party members that we should all rally around our party and solve all the problems we have locally without allowing it to be something that will make other people within the party to sabotage the effort of the party to form the next government in 2027. So party discipline, and also
